Barber Roll Call / Official Smack Talk Thread

#41

I’d like to refer everyone to the forum posting rules. They specifically outlaw personal attacks on another member. Calling someone a cheater, I suspect, would qualify as an attack.

There is a lot of lighthearted smacktalk on the board, which everyone recognizes, and I don’t think anyone has a problem with it. But, when the smack turns ugly and serious, it’s getting out of bounds. Sections of this thread have gone way past the limits.

The online forum is not the place to impugn someone else’s integrity. If one competitor thinks another’s car is not legal, file a protest. The protest process is not designed to be seen as a personal attack. Contrary to what some of you might think, there is a lot in the rules that is open to interpretation. A different opinion than your own doesn’t brand the other party a cheater.

Whether you formally protest or not, don’t whine about it here. It solves nothing, but creates hard feelings all around.

Good thing this isn’t the old Wild West. Talk like we’ve seen here today would have resulted in people being called out for a showdown at high noon with 6-shooters.

#42

Patton wrote:

:frowning:

i guess the truth hurts…

#43

Gasman wrote:

I don’t know what you were reading Steve, but here is what I posted. Hardly an attack:

[quote]Bending and breaking are two very different things. If you have such a huge issue with everything that you post about, do what you’re supposed to do, protest it.

What you read one way in the rules I read exactly the opposite. Your interpretation is just that, yours. If you feel passionate enough about an alleged infraction, protest it and let Carter decide, but please, please stop quoting the CCR every other post and handle it where it needs to be handled - at the track.[/quote]

I’ve never said “everyone bent the rules”. My argument was purely academic. I don’t know when you turned the corner in your head to decide that I was actually cheating. Defending the position and putting it into action two very different things.

Bending the rules is another way of saying there are grey area that have multiple interpretations. My point is that your’s is just as wrong/right as mine. We’ll never have an answer unless the proper channels are pursued, ie. protesting questionable modifications. I think it would be great if there were some protests out there. It would give us an even more stable rule set, a plus for everyone. While you chastise GRM for their actions, I applaud them for publicly pointing out a vague rule and forcing a clarification so that the spirit of the rules remain intact.

The main point was, let’s all stop posting about it constantly and handle it in the correct manner; protests at the track. “Its time to put up or shut up” - D. Moses

JP

PS - If I paid for a cheater motor I should be royally pissed with my 149rwhp…

#44

JP, Obviously we will continue to debate this. The rules are not vague where ballast can be placed. “Passenger compartment forward of the seat mounts”. The rules are vague as to what one could define as ballast, however the rules do not say spare tire modifications are allowed. If the rules don’t say it can be done, the assumption has always been you can’t do it.

#45

Apparently the old addage is true -

“Arguing on the internet is like the Special Olymics. Even if you win you’re still retarded.” - Al Gore

If you aren’t going to protest it you have no right to complain about it.

Even Carter said its not illegal, and he wrote the rule.

I’m done.

#46

[quote]155MPH wrote “Its time to put up or shut up” - D. Moses

JP

[/quote]

I think that quote should be attributed to Randy. I am sure he still has the artwork on file for that sticker;)

This whole thing is feeling very familiar, and exactly why I don’t hold a BMWCCA racing license anymore. Been down this road before and would rather not go down it again.

#47

Maybe I should have stopped reading posts on the board when I sold my car but I enjoy racing vicariosly through you guys. This is my first post in months and I have resisted the temptation to put my 2 cents in until now. Sorry to continue this off topic discussion and maybe I have no right to say since I’m not an active SE30 racer but I have to speak up.

It seems that Steve has a no problems making innuendos about certain people bending (ie. cheating) the rules. Yet he consitantly states that he will not protest anyone. What is the point of even bringing up certain issues on a public forum if you have intention of pursuing it through the proper channels? This just breeds bad blood among fellow racers. A little less vinegar and a little more honey! My mother alway told me if I don’t have anything nice to say…don’t say it. That’s all for now.

You guys have fun and Barber. I’m looking forward to reading the reports and watching the videos. And by the way, if anyone wants to go for a boat ride sometime just let me know. I find it much more relaxing B)

#48

dmwhite wrote:

[quote]Patton wrote:

:frowning:

i guess the truth hurts…[/quote]

Oops, Dave caught me. Now I’m going to have to back-up the smack talk with some cornering talent. DW the race (behind the rest of the pack…see how I’m backig down already)is on.

Regards, Robert Patton

#49

You guys are passionate about SE30 racing and that is what attracted me to this class. I don’t have a dog in this particular fight, but I’m not smart enough to stay away.:blink:

Rules bickering is a normal part of racing. As I see it, there are various levels of prep (or escalating levels of pushing the rules):

  1. “Intent” legal - Boy, that one’s tough to nail down.
  2. Non-compliant in non-performance items - Is your oil pan protection plate truly a “…flat aluminum sheet…” as required by the rules or does it have some bends in it to fit around the pan closely?
  3. Non-compliant, performance-related, unintentional - I had some insulation on my Miata intake between the AFM and the manifold. Rules said intake could be insulated before the AFM. A competitor pointed this out in the paddock and the problem was solved.
  4. Grey areas/clever interpretation - I think most folks see this as the “bending” category. Protests help clarify these rules (see GRM spare tire experiment).
  5. Tech Shed legal - Some guys will intentionally break the rules in areas they know cannot be detected in the tech shed. My personal opinion is that this category presents the biggest problem.
  6. Illegal, intentional - e.g. running a 1.8l Miata without a restrictor plate.

Gasman wrote:

It is crystal clear on where ballast can be placed. But not all added weight is “ballast.”

What if the GRM folks - realizing that they needed weight in the rear - rigged up a 2" thick radiator mounted in the trunk, filled it with oil and and ran lines to the engine? The rules permit oil coolers. The rules don’t require that it be very effective. Same end result - weight placed where it was needed. More $ spent.

Maybe they should have simply bought a huge a$$ battery since that can be “replaced”. A 100 lb battery would meet or exceed OEM specs (the rules definition of “replaced”).

Steve D.

#50

Re: the original thread topic…

Can’t make it to Barber :frowning: My eldest son is graduating from high school that weekend so dad duties take precedence.

FWIW - I liked Barber (the track) the one DE I did there. Sorry I’m gonna miss it. You guys have fun!

#51

scottmc wrote:

[quote]

I can’t believe you don’t love RRR racing. I always have the best time there. IFU or not… it’s a great track IMO[/quote]

I haven’t raced there yet, only DE’s! Maybe that will change my mind. I just think the track itself is boring.

:unsure:

#52

My two cents on the cheating stuff…until I start winning, I think all of you are cheating, as I am clearly a better driver than all of you.

So there. Back to smack talk.

:stuck_out_tongue:

#53

Patton wrote:

[quote]Oops, Dave caught me. Now I’m going to have to back-up the smack talk with some cornering talent. DW the race (behind the rest of the pack…see how I’m backig down already)is on.

Regards, Robert Patton[/quote]

:wink:

#54

For everyone that IS coming to Barber, you better watch out for the Silver Bullet!

It remains to be seen if you should watch out because it’s fast or watch out and don’t run over it! Stay tuned!

#55

Matt, the Silver Bullet/357. Cool theme. Look forward to racing with you at Barber.

Regards, Robert Patton

#56

I’m diggin the number Matt;) Faster than a speeding bullet I hope!

#57

The silver bullet won’t slow you down.

all you need now is the coor’s vinyl and free beer sponsorship.

#58

yeah, I considered calling my team “American Style Pale Lager Tech Racing”, but it just didn’t have a good ring to it (and I couldn’t make the vinyl fit the car).

Damion - I’ll take as fast as a speeding bullet (or even slightly slower)!!!

#59

M3Bill wrote:

[quote]scottmc wrote:

[quote]

I can’t believe you don’t love RRR racing. I always have the best time there. IFU or not… it’s a great track IMO[/quote]

I haven’t raced there yet, only DE’s! Maybe that will change my mind. I just think the track itself is boring.

:unsure:[/quote]

This is off topic but at this point what’s not off topic in this thread.

Bill,
I’d be willing to bet… one race at RRR will totally change the way you feel about that track. Read Brian latest race report on on blog:

http://beertechracing.blogspot.com/

#60

I haven’t raced there yet, only DE’s! Maybe that will change my mind. I just think the track itself is boring.

uote]

If you think the track is boring…you aren’t going fast enough:blink: Chuck