Much to the wife’s dismay I’ve taken the plunge, I’m plotting my destiny to join the other certifiables here in friendly competition. I’ve probably already committed a number of cardinal sins but the first I’ll admit to is buying a street car with the intent of building a Spec car. And I’m probably about to commit the second by asking if an SE30 can ever be a DD? I don’t generally care much about creature comforts but I do like a nice heater core from time to time and I am fairly worried about roll cages and unhelmeted noggins. After getting derided for this question, I’ll go on to ask the other usual newbie stuff. Where’s a good place in the MidWest to get a roll cage built? (I’ve heard a couple of folks at NASA events mention a builder in the Dayton/Cinncinati area.) How much foot protection do I need? Where does the bulk of the money go in building up an SE30? And about how much should I budget? I just spent 10 grand dropping a new S54 into my M3 after it ingested a valve so whatever numbers you post are going to seem like a bargain. How difficult is the comp license? I’ve been doing DEs for about a decade and drive with the A or 3/4 groups. Will I be terminally depressed the first time I’m passed by a Spec Miata? Etc, etc, etc. All ruminations welcome.
YAWN (Yet Another Wet behind the ears Newbie)
Keep your current e30 as your regular street driver and buy another one that has already been built for racing if you want to save money, time, and hassle. Really, this is the way to go, unless you just really want to get into the car building process. FYI, my racer is still street legal, and I take it for a drive every few weeks; I can also avoid trailering for nearby tracks, four door helps for carrying tires, gear, etc… Note, i am also still a beginner and have a long way to go to podium. I sometimes wear a bike helmet when driving the racer on the street.
With all those DEs, I would think you are ready for comp license, but maybe try a de or two in the se30 to get comfy with the car characteristics… Talk to your regional director about it.
And if you are taking advice from me, well… Heh, heh… Just study this forum… It is an unbelievably awesome resource.
I would say choose the route that looks like the best balance of fun vs expense.
Here is a quick list of where the bulk of my money went (approximations):
1987 325is with busted transmission and shifter $800
Autosolutions shifter $300
Used transmission $250
Spec Suspension $800
Spec Swaybars $300
Spec Camber Plates $300
Spec wheels and new shaved RA1s $1100
Roll Cage $1900
Harness $200
Fire Bottle $400
Seat and mounts $500
Spec Exhaust $200
Paint job and decals $1000
Brake pads, rotors, lines, fluid $500
I did the build one up from scratch method. I enjoyed it as working on cars is something I do for fun. If this isn’t the case, then I would also recommend buying one of the well sorted examples for sale in the Classifieds.
+1 on keeping your E30 a DD and buying an already prepped car. A couple yrs ago I read “buy your first race car, then if you really want to, you can build your 2nd”. IMO most folks that decide to enter SpecE30 by building their own car end up failing. They underestimate the cost and labor involved and eventually their enthusiasm ebbs.
It sounds like you’ve got enough background to go to comp school immed. Keep an eye out for “open passing” track days and link up with some racers that would be willing to mix it up with you. That’s great practice having cars in close proximity, reading the other guy’s mind, passing off-line, etc. Those are the things you will now have to get comfortable with.
Thanks for the replies. I built one of those Cobra replicas from Factory Five for kicks and grins so I’m okay with doing all the work to build an SE30 I’ve read about so far. The budget numbers look pretty good too. I’m starting with a very clean, low mileage example with everything functional so probably mostly need a real suspension and a real interior. I have some cheapie APC seats I bought for the Cobra gathering dust in the attic which I’ll put in for now, the stock seats are shot, but I doubt they’re good enough for track use. And I have run several open passing sessions. Got surprised a few times by Z06’s and GT3-RS’s coming out of nowhere, but otherwise it was a hoot. Question about the spec exhaust. From a relatively brief examination of the rule book it looks like you can choose to run either the spec or stock exhaust systems. Is there a significant benefit to the spec exhaust?
There is an advantage to the Spec E30 exhaust and depending on the condition of the catalytic converters there can be a large advantage.
Good question. I think there are few MW guys and the NASA events I’ve been to that host a reasonable field of E30s all seem to be crossovers with the Great Lakes region. I’m guessing that’s where the bulk of the E30s are right now.
We in the MW region are looking to match the number of GL cars by the last crossover of 2012.
I definitely recommend buying a built car with spares. I already knew this but I built a car anyway. I just have to do it the hard way I guess. Building a car is a guaranteed bad investment. I think my low budget build has cost me more than it would have cost to buy a car.
The midwest should have a couple cars next season. My car needs a few things yet like converting from bolts to wheel studs and fixing the abs but it could race as is. I’m in DE4 right now but plan on doing comp school the first race of next season. I’m living in Milwaukee and keep the car at my parents house up north. Cosmos is in Chicago and has bought a built car. Kgobey has been racing spece30 for a while and plans to move back to Chicago from California. There are a few others who have run gts and are building a car now or are planning to.
PM Cosmos with your email so he can put you in the google group. I was in the white e30 at autobahn in july. You weren’t the guy in the red cobra were you.
I don’t think se30s should be DDs. I’ve limped home two leaking water pumps and a head gasket. The seven hour drive from NC to road atlanta is a lot longer when you have to stop and wait for the car to cool off and then add water every hour, but you need to be at work at 615 on monday morning. I don’t think the rules should accommodate the DD cars but that’s something the people who actually have a vote don’t agree with me on.
6k is the cheapest I’ve seen a logbooked car sold for. Buy it!!! See the classifieds.
Ok It’s not in our classifieds. Just click the recent topics tab and you’ll find it.
I think that says more about the car’s prep and condition than the wisdom of DD’ing a Spec E30.
I wouldn’t DD a Spec E30, but not because I was concerned about reliability. Properly prepared the car will be far more reliable than the average E30. Dealing with a race seat, harnesses, noise, and the stiffness of the suspension gets really tiresome really fast.
The car was a very early work in progress at the time. They’re not very comfortable to sleep in at the track either.
True, but a tent, air mattress, and sleeping bag can be stuffed into the car’s corners for the trip.
Jim, I’m absolutely with you on the noise and suspension stiffness, I have that Cobra kit car. But it’s okay for the short commute to and from work. I don’t have a tow rig and so far have driven to and from all track sessions. Until the E46 blew up at Mid-Ohio in September. That was a lot of fun. And I’m the guy in the “backpacker” solo tent. So I get that too. As far as prep, what new engine parts need to go in just as a matter of course? The car has 138k on it. And is the TMS SE30 suspension kit a good choice?
Turbo, I’ll PM Cosmos and no the Cobra hasn’t been tracked yet because it’s not a spec car and most orgs don’t like the open top with only a roll bar. PCA is an exception. I’m in a silver E46 M3.
Unless you have proof of recent replacements I’d replace:
Timing belt & cam shaft seal
Valve cover gasket & bungs
Water pump
Thermostat (and housing if the nipples are corroded)
Radiator
Expansion tank
All coolant hoses
All intake related hoses that connect to the throttle body & booster check valve
Replace the intake manifold gaskets & oil return tube seals
Have the injectors cleaned, rebuilt, & flow tested
Fuel Pressure Regulator
Fan clutch (or convert to electric)
Alternator belt
Ignition wires
Distributor rotor & cap
Alternator voltage regulator (or alternator if the bearings are noisy)
Main & fuel pump relays
Crank Position Sensor and the wiring chase on the front of the timing cover
Control arms & bushings
Tie rods
Front and rear wheel bearings
Motor, transmission, and differential mounts
Subframe bushings
Trailing arm bushings (or install weld-in camber & toe adjusters)
Clutch, rear main seal, pilot bearing, and fork pivot pin
All transmission seals
Guibo (and driveshaft/CSB if there is binding in the u-joints)
Rebuild all calipers
Soft brake lines
Brake master cylinder & reservoir (and booster if there is any fluid in it)
Clutch master & slave cylinders and soft lines
Throttle rod bushings
Accelerator cable
Replace the boots (with OE kits) on the half shafts
All fuel system hoses
Install a crank scraper (or better yet a scraper and a baffled pan)
Rebuild the oil filter adapter and replace all seals
Rebuild the oil cooler hoses
Since rust in the fuel tank is very likely, I drop the tank, acid clean it, and seal it. At the least I’d replace the fuel pump(s). If a late car with the 63L tank I’ll add a transfer pump to the left side and replace the stock pump with a late 318is pump.
I also splice out the fusible link in the DME power cable and install a 60A lug type fuse for that cable at the power point in the engine bay.
If you are going to keep the Power Steering system, replace all hoses & reservoir. Reseal or replace the pump if it is leaking. I remove the pump and connect both lines from the reservoir to the rack.
In a number of cases it matters what parts you use. I only use factory reman alternators or starters. The generic rebuilds are iffy. In a like manner I only use new OE brake & clutch hydraulic parts. The non-OE half shaft boots don’t fit correctly, so those are also OE only. In general you want OE or from the OE manufacturer. Those parts are more expensive, but they work better and last longer.
At some point (if the engine has good oil pressure and decent compression & leak down numbers) you should pull the head and have it rebuilt to race standards.
This may seem like a lot and there are certainly Spec E30’s that haven’t (yet) had all this done. But these are 20’ish year old cars and replacing all this stuff goes a long way towards improving reliability & performance. With only a few exceptions I’ll do this to any E30, even if it will only be a DD.
I don’t have any opinion on the TMS kit. I’ve bought my Spec E30 suspension parts from Bimmerworld.