Transmission Fluid leak - rules clarification

#1

Two questions in one…

  1. I own a car that once lived as a (sad) auto-slushbox. I noted in another thread that now that my car can live it’s life of fulfillment with 5 manually rowed gears, this may, per the letter of the rules, be not legal. As I belive I am not alone in this quandry, next time we visit the rules, can we have a tiny clarification that the swap of transmissions is as legal as the swap of engines? Don’t see it being an issue at all.

To that new 5 speed, I suffer from the same affliction I have read on another thread of some leakage from the tranny after a fun weekend at the track. I read of the solution - a 5/32" hose attached to the vent on the tranny to act as a reservoir to refill the tranny. Great idea - and I was all set to do a fluid change and install the hose. One problem - nowhere in the rules does it say I can…

A: add a hose to the transmission in a place it did not come from the factory with
B: remove the top part of vent as needed to fit the vent

Am I missing something in the rules, or is this an oversight? Any issue with fitting the hose? Certainly seems to fit in the spirit of SpecE30 (cheap, easy, non-performance enhancing other than from a longevity standpoint).

I would love to hear what the thoughts are on this - I plan on doing the install this weekend, if it is OK…

Thanks!

#2

It is not technically written into the current rules but it is viewed like the trunk light issue. Meaning that if you dont have a working trunk light, technically your car is illegal but no one will protest you for it.

Within the spirit of the series and the rule set, the hose is being allowed for a couple of reasons;

  1. Leakage is a known issue on these cars and this is a cheap, simple, effective fix.
  2. Keeps oil off of the racing surface for safety.
  3. Helps to protect against costly and time consuming tranny repair/replacement, keeping the costs down.

It would be nice to have this added to the rules in the next edition so no one feels that they may be bending the rules. Carter?

#3

I agree on all points. It just makes sense. Of course, if we really were interested in keeping fluid off the track surface, we would ban 911s from racetracks :slight_smile:

If this is “Standard Procedure”, and nobody will protest, and there is a good chance of it making the rules change next time, I’ll go ahead. Thanks!

#4

jblack wrote:

[quote]I agree on all points. It just makes sense. Of course, if we really were interested in keeping fluid off the track surface, we would ban 911s from racetracks :slight_smile:
[/quote]

:laugh:

good one

#5

As to (1), I think that:

9.3.12.1. Transmission shall be original or factory option for the model/year, no alterations or substitutions permitted.

Allows the swap of a Getrag 260 for the slush box.

As to the transmission breather, I think you could argue that:

8.10.1. A catch tank for radiator overflow and oil breather (if vented into the atmosphere) is mandatory.

applies. And that any car not equipped with a catch tank for the transmission (and differential) is in violation of the rules. I understand that 8.10.1 is meant to apply to the engine, but it is in section 8, which is for general Safety Equipment and it doesn’t specifically mention the engine…

#6

I read 9.3.12.1 - I do agree with you, but - the transmission in my car is not original or a factory option. It is the factory standard transmission in another guy’s 325i. I would argue the same that you are - just looking to avoid the argument completely, as someone else in a different thread brought up.

And I like your idea on 8.10.1! Again - it would take nothing to add a line in about a tranny catch “tank” (even though my tank will look suspiciously like a hose).

Thanks for the help on this! I am just trying to get nobody to notice my carbon fiber fenders and hood (kidding)…

#7

nobody could possibly argue (seriously) that 9.3.12.1 is meant to mean that you have to have the original tranny that was delivered in your car - it says for the "model/year"
cheers,
bruce

#8

Somebody did (in the GRM spart tire thread). That’s the only reason I mention it. I’m with you 100% Bruce - as long as it’s done to factory specs, who cares? I’d just like it clarified next time around.

#9

John,

If someone throws the book at you for an tranny swap; I’ll take the same book :wink:

#10

Note that 9.3.12.1 says “original or factory option for the model/year”. E30 325i/is could be equipped from the factory with either the auto or a Getrag 260 manual. As long as you use an unmodified Getrag 260 to replace the auto you are fine w/respect to the rules.

#11

jlevie wrote:

[quote]As to (1), I think that:

9.3.12.1. Transmission shall be original or factory option for the model/year, no alterations or substitutions permitted.

Allows the swap of a Getrag 260 for the slush box.

As to the transmission breather, I think you could argue that:

8.10.1. A catch tank for radiator overflow and oil breather (if vented into the atmosphere) is mandatory.

applies. And that any car not equipped with a catch tank for the transmission (and differential) is in violation of the rules. I understand that 8.10.1 is meant to apply to the engine, but it is in section 8, which is for general Safety Equipment and it doesn’t specifically mention the engine…[/quote]

I would agree completely with your assessment that a car not having a vent tube to a catch can is in violation. I disagree that 8.10 is meant to apply only to the engine. The transmission contains oil and it has a breather/vent.

#12

Make sure you put one on the diff why you are at it.

Michael

#13

Is there an oil breather on the diff?

#14

Yes.

#15

ilateapex wrote:

I didn’t know this, where is it?

#16

Back, Right, Top. I think

#17

(stole a pic of some guy’s cleaned up diff from ebay)

I believe it’s in the top right on the diff cover.

#18

Guys:

At the suggestion of Chuck Taylor, the Southeast Spec E30 Series Director, I’m going to spend more time here in the Rules area.

Technically, I manage the Rules and NASA enforces them at NASA events per their procedures but I do need to spend more time here, for issues like this. Technicaly, I can only offer my opinion on how I think a NASA official will rule on a specific issue/protest but Chuck is right and I’ll be here every few days.

No Spec E30 official is ever going to take action against a driver for something like adding a hose to the trans breather (I added one to mine because of the replacement tranny was pushing fluid out; the original trans never did) that is intended to do all the things mentioned in this thread. And I think it’s safe to say that NASA will never DQ (through a protest) a driver for something like this.

Yes, per the suggestion here, we’ll add it to the Rules.

Thanks for bringing it up and for the followup posts. For sure, this kind of level-headed discussion makes Spec E30 better.

Carter Hunt
Spec E30 National Series Director

#19

Where is the vent on the trans? where would you run the 5/32 line to? and how long of a line are we talking about? Thank.

#20

Kelly, the vent is on the top passenger side of the transmission. I ran my hose out toward the firewall up to the wiring harness and down the fender to the windshield washer resevoir, which was converted to a “catch can”. I might add that it is completely full of oil after a race weekend.