spec E30 vs. GTS

#1

Hi guys

I’ve got a question for you. I am signed up for the comp school @ VIR in July. My car ('89 325) was set up for spec E30 while going through HPDEs and had planned on racing in spec E30 also, but I wanted more power so I swapped in a '95 M3 drivetrain, brakes, etc… Now that i’m this close - consumable costs (brakes and tires) have me a little concerned.

I guess my question is - is there any of you guys that used to race other higher powered cars that have switched to spec E30 and been happy w/ the power? Do you forget about it when the flag drops?

I know its got to be different actually racing against equally powered cars compared to running "against" vettes, M3s, WRXs, and mustangs in HPDEs. I was happy w/ everything about the car except the power - I still have the spec suspension under the car.

Hope I didn’t ramble too much. And thanks for your time.

Ryan

#2

Ryan:

I took my '04 GTO to the track and yes, 350 hp is a lot of fun. Hanging the tail out and doing a long powerslide is entertaining.

But honestly, I enjoy my Spec E30 much more…for several reasons.

  1. The close racing
  2. The low costs
  3. The weekend experience with Spec E30 friends.
  4. Knowing that the Spec E30 Rules are stable.

I’m sure you will enjoy your car but come see us if you’re ever interested in Spec E30.

'See you in July.

Carter

#3

I ran my '06 mitsu Evolution at CMP in HPDE group 2 in May. All that horsepower, unreal handling, insane stopping torque and four wheel drifts through faith hope and charity was fun. But NOT anywhere as much fun as driving the little silver mercedes c-coupe I used last year.

The difference was the Evo lapped the entire field, wet, dry didn’t matter. It wasn’t challenging. The c-coupe required more skill to drive. I wouldn’t even consider not doing spec e30 with all the close racing, great people and fun these guys have at EVERY event.

GTS is classed power/weight. There’s no reason you couldn’t do both with a Spec car.

#4

Tom is right…A spec E30 can be classed as a GTS car and GTS runs in the Thunder group so you can actually Race both classes in a weekend. That would mean 2 entries but you would get a boatload of track time.In order to be classed in GTS you need an approved Dyno sheet

#5

nasaregistrar wrote:

I think if you don’t have a dyno sheet, you can still run under GTS-U right?

#6

That is the default with no dyno

#7

The SE30 wouldn’t be competitive in GTS. You could esentially get your butt handed to you by another 325 w/ unlimited suspension, aero, and hoosiers (though the latter you could also put on the SE30 during a GTS race).

The bigger problem is in the MA region is that the GTS guys run in the same group (autobahn) as the SE30s - no chance to do both in one weekend.

SMD

#8

Another thought or two regarding this topic…

A. How many times have we heard that learning to drive a slow car fast makes you a better driver?

Point, recommended Spec E30 this afternoon to a friend who is into Porsche Club racing, he is having trouble getting the shop to finish his car. He said he needs the horsepower and wouldn’t be good enough to drive in Spec E30. Mentioned the ability required to keep momentum and not scrub speed. All the reasons I LOVE the Spec E30 concept.

B. How fast are you now, really?

Start racing Spec E30, and if with equal opportunity you are beating the pants off Chris C., Carter H., Carlton G., Dave P., Brain etc… and you are too good of a driver for the series, drop the M3 driveline back in and switch to GTS-U.

Personally, to get track time, I want to do both Spec E30 and GTS. Doesn’t matter if I am competetive in GTS, I just want the seat time.

#9

The best way to get fast is track time,
The biggest limiting factor for track time is money (for me that is)
Spec e30 has got to be the cheapest way to get wheel to wheel time that I have costed out.

So after car prep, it comes down to consumables.

Spec e30 has that going for it also.

So I did my own comparison between my spec e30 and my buddies #1 e36:
Need a PTG built motor to win, nope
Need AP Unobtanium brakes to win, nope
Need moton/penske remote resevoir shocks with more adjustment knobs than a 747, nope
Need a PTG mechanic and a weekend of track time to get this suspension right, nope
Need 8 in wide slicks at $250 a piece, nope

That to me is the direct comparison between a High HP e36 and spec e30.

I would love the first choice, I can afford the second choice.

Ben

#10

smdubovsky wrote:

[quote]The SE30 wouldn’t be competitive in GTS. You could esentially get your butt handed to you by another 325 w/ unlimited suspension, aero, and hoosiers (though the latter you could also put on the SE30 during a GTS race).

The bigger problem is in the MA region is that the GTS guys run in the same group (autobahn) as the SE30s - no chance to do both in one weekend.

SMD[/quote]
Nope…GTS is in Thunder this year at their request

#11

PTG is literally right around the corner from my house…I got to go on a tour there once. Pretty cool stuff in there.

#12

I completly aggree :great stuff, great cars, great mechanics and truly great service.
I was there the weekend we brought in the PTG mechanic to do the suspension setup and it was absolutely amazing what this guy knew.

But my buddy has more in his engine than I would plan on having in 2 cars.

#13

Thanks for your responses

I am going to start re-reading the spec E30 rules and see if i’ve modified or removed anything that is not reversible. If everything looks ok, I might switch back. I wish I had held on to my Team Dynamics/Toyos. And just two weeks ago I sold a set of bottlecaps (could have been my rains). Oh well.

If i’ve gone too far w/ the M powered car I do have access to another '89 and might be able to get that done in time.

Thanks again

Ryan

#14

You know, if you’ve already done the swap I think I would recommend doing a few GTS races as-is before thinking about swapping an M20 back in. Please, no one take this as a dig at spec e30 in any way, shape, or form. But if the car is already ready to go in GTS, I would personally strongly think about at least trying the water there before going through the work of swapping engines. I also think that the spec suspension setup can at least ‘hold it’s own’, if maybe not win in GTS.

#15

rshand325 wrote:

B)

They did go to a good home though.

#16

sdais wrote:

I agree with Steve. Do a few events, see how GTS is doing compared to Spec E30, and make your decision after that. Think about what is important to you, and decide where you want to go, racing-wise.

Carter

#17

I also think that the spec suspension setup can at least ‘hold it’s own’, if maybe not win in GTS.[/quote]

So far I have been really happy w/ the suspension. I have only done VIR full and S.P. Shen. but so far so good.

I think Iwill try to run some GTS races. Its just that when I compare costs of M3 brakes, 17" tires, spare 17" rain tires/wheels to E30 stuff I start to question my budget. Maybe I’ll cross my fingers and hope for no rain on race weekends and skip the rains.

Has anybody kept track of expenses for a typical spec E30 race year?

Ryan