This might be a totally dumb question but I have the AutoPower Seat Back Brace and a Kirkey seat. I have this brace:
Just like in the pic, it is not bolted to the seat. To meet NASA specs, does it have to be bolted to the seat??
Seat Back Brace
ohiobimmer
#1
Ranger
#4
Check Kirkey’s requirements too. Some of their seats are supposed to be anchored at bottom at at back.
I have the same seat brace as in your pic, but my seat’s not aluminum.
Elephant4
#5
So you guys are saying you don’t have to bolt it to the seat once the seat expires?
I need to get a seat back brace which one is that? Any recomendations? I have a recaro seat fwiw.
Thanks.
Ranger
#6
[quote=“Elephant4” post=55193]So you guys are saying you don’t have to bolt it to the seat once the seat expires?
I need to get a seat back brace which one is that? Any recomendations? I have a recaro seat fwiw.
Thanks.[/quote]
PO said the brace was from Autopower. I don’t recall who I bought mine from.
Normal non-metal seats do not get fastened to the brace. I’d just put in some padding between brace and seat and have them touch or almost touch. If you drilled holes in the non-metallic seat you’d probably fail tech if they noticed it. The seat’s certification assumes that it’s going to be installed per the manuf’s guidance.
Some Aluminum seats require the rear of the seat to be fastened to the cage. This isn’t a NASA requirement it’s a manufacturer’s requirement. But it could suddenly become a NASA requirement if the tech insp says “hey, isn’t this seat supposed to be fastened at the back”? To eliminate ambiguity, you might bring the seat manuf’s install guidance to tech, so the inspector can see that your Al seat does not require the back to be fastened to the cage, assuming that’s the case.
Side note. One way to get seats cheap is to find a nice FIA seat that is >5yrs old, and therefore the cert has expired. Expired seats are cheap and all you have to do to race with it is put in the back brace. I have a cherry Sparco that fits this description that needs to get sold to someone with a skinny ass.
ohiobimmer
#7
I have the Autopower one shown in that pic. The rules say nothing about the brace being bolted to the seat. I only brought it up because I have a buddy who raced SCCA several years ago and he said that his was bolted to the seat.
15.6.22 Seat Back Support
A seatback support must be made to hold the seat from going back in the event of a
crash. A plate should be used to distribute the load. No bolts, corners, or sharp objects
should be placed in such a manner that could lead to a possible puncture of the driver in
a high impact crash. Proper design and installation is crucial to safety and it is
recommended that the driver employ the services of a professional race car builder for
this, as well as all other vehicle safety items. An exception may be made for those seats
homologated to, and mounted in accordance with, FIA 8855-1999 or 8862-2009
standards. Those seats that qualify for the aforementioned exception must conform to
the entire FIA 8855-1999 or 8862-2009 set of regulations, as applicable. This includes a
mandatory seat replacement, or use of a seat back brace, for any seat more than five (5)
years old (8899-1999) or more than ten (10) years old (8862-2009). Please reference
the FIA regulations. http://www.fia.com/
ohiobimmer
#8
[quote=“Ranger” post=55196][quote=“Elephant4” post=55193]So you guys are saying you don’t have to bolt it to the seat once the seat expires?
I need to get a seat back brace which one is that? Any recomendations? I have a recaro seat fwiw.
Thanks.[/quote]
PO said the brace was from Autopower. I don’t recall who I bought mine from.
Normal non-metal seats do not get fastened to the brace. I’d just put in some padding between brace and seat and have them touch or almost touch. If you drilled holes in the non-metallic seat you’d probably fail tech if they noticed it. The seat’s certification assumes that it’s going to be installed per the manuf’s guidance.
Some Aluminum seats require the rear of the seat to be fastened to the cage. This isn’t a NASA requirement it’s a manufacturer’s requirement. But it could suddenly become a NASA requirement if the tech insp says “hey, isn’t this seat supposed to be fastened at the back”. To eliminate ambiguiety, you might bring the seat manuf’s install guidance to tech, so the inspector can see that your Al seat does not require the back to be fastened to the cage, assuming that’s the case.
Side note. One way to get seats cheap is to find a nice FIA seat that is >5yrs old, and therefore the cert has expired. Expired seats are cheap and all you have to do to race with it is put in the back brace. I have a cherry Sparco that fits this description that needs to get sold to someone with a skinny ass.[/quote]
Ranger knows what’s up. I have 2 seats, a Kirkey 47 series and an Ultra Shield Road Race. The Kirkey installation guide recommends that the seat get mounted at 6 points. 4 on the floor and 2 in the rear under the shoulder harness. As well, I just called Ultra Shield and they recommend the same. I would say that basically any Alum. seat manufacturer is going to say. Looks like I’ll be drilling and bolting. Add that to the list 
Interesting that the Autopower pic of the brace shows an alum seat without it being bolted to it…
Steve_D
#9
Bear in mind that composite seats are not designed to be used with a seat back brace. They are designed to flex to dissipate energy. Adding a brace puts stress on the seat in an area it was not designed for. There is a reason those seats have expiration dates. UV rays and use tend to compromise their structure.
You can’t go wrong with a new seat. You can go wrong with an untested brace installation.
Just be sure the brace is low enough that your spinal cord break only paralyzes your legs.
Ranger
#10
[quote=“Steve D” post=55214]Bear in mind that composite seats are not designed to be used with a seat back brace. They are designed to flex to dissipate energy. Adding a brace puts stress on the seat in an area it was not designed for. There is a reason those seats have expiration dates. UV rays and use tend to compromise their structure.
You can’t go wrong with a new seat. You can go wrong with an untested brace installation.
Just be sure the brace is low enough that your spinal cord break only paralyzes your legs.[/quote]
Lol, Steve and I never agree on anything.
I would submit that the amount of “Moment” on the seat base is hellacious in a crash because the seat back is a moment arm. A brace on the back would hugely reduce the amount of force on the seat base in the event of a rearward collision. Sure, there’d be some force on the seat back because of the brace but it would be orders of magnatude less. And a padded back support spreads the force across a broad area, as opposed to the small area of the seat bolts. Finally, the seat companies know that their seats are often used with a back brace. Therefore their design would take that into account.
It’s hard for me to worry about UV. The SFI and FIA UV specs assume 24hrs/day 7days/week. Most cars are stored inside.
Steve_D
#11
Ranger -
Your GressGuessEngineering™ may prove to be right. I just wanted to have a counter-argument in the thread so people don’t assume your conclusions are unimpeachable.
I am more comfortable with the risk that the seat detaches from the floor (especially since the seat and I are held generally in place by the belts if all four mounting bolts fail) than the risk that my spine has to withstand an impact against an untested seat back brace.
Simply put, the seats are designed (intended!) to flex. A brace prevents that.
An exception to this rule is the Racetech seat that includes built-in bracing in the seat and an integral attachment system for the brace. That is my next seat.
Ranger
#13
Recall that the seat brace in the PO’s first post is by Autopower. Someone is selling one on ebay.
ohiobimmer
#14
[quote=“Ranger” post=55331]Recall that the seat brace in the PO’s first post is by Autopower. Someone is selling one on ebay.
Please note that it is marked as “used” but yet it does not have holes drilled into it 
Looks like a good deal.