Ranger's motorswap thread

#161

cwbaader wrote:

All my lines have hose clamps. Did you perceive that I was encouraging otherwise?

#162

Yes. CB

#163

Word came back from the shop with the head. The cause of the failure was a missing rocker arm shaft locking bar, not a tbelt failure. Of course it was f*****g missing because they forgot to install it. Just like they forgot to tighten some eccentrics and they forgot to include an oiling bar. Of course it’s on me because they’d “never make a mistake like that”.

I can live with shit being my fault. That’s the risk I take trying to learn how to do things myself. But when I go to great lengths to get first class shit done by pros and I pay thru the ass for it, it needs to be right.

I think that my pic below shows this rocker arm shaft locking bar that prevents the shafts from turning. Is that correct?

#164

Damn…yes, that is it. Pretty important part, I think.

When I had a cyl head done a couple of years ago, by a pro, he left all the eccentrics completely loose, which I thought was strange, it sounded pretty bad when I fired it up, not sure if I did any damage but one of those new rocker arms is the only one I have ever broken…

Another Ah f******g hah. I “May” have found the cause of my low HP. When checking my spark plugs they looked a little lean, now I have just been driving the car on the highway,so I thought if it is lean on the highway, it must really be lean on the track. I decided to check my fuel filter, and was suprised to see “made in China”…now I am pretty damn picky about parts, so I couldn’t figure it out for a while…it seems I had put a cheap filter on with plans to change it quickly as the car had been sitting for a while before I built it. I figured I would sacrifice a cheap filter…well the stuff that back drained out of the filter would not pass for gas. The car never stuttered or missed but it must have been close to it. The last Dyno for the “Crate Motor” was 145, I am hoping that with the filter change, fresh plugs I can hit 150…

Al

#165

All my rockers have to be replaced because of this. When the shafts turned all the rockers started beating themselves to death (on their clips?), so they are all nicked up.

All new rockers is going to make the price of the repair go up a bit. That’s sad, but I’m so pissed about being punked by the head builder that the money doesn’t matter.

#166

Scott, I believe all the locking pin does is keep the rocker arm shafts from moving fore and aft. So if it is not in place, the shaft will move relative to the cam shaft and float back and forth the 1/2 inch or so between the rubber sealing plugs. I imagine this could result in the rocker arm eccentrics moving off of the top of the valve and result in the damage described.
Ed

#167

I’d like to think that I’m due for a long stretch of really good luck. Starting any time now. This 6 month affair has given my reserves of optimism a workout.

#168

Ranger, if you want a cyl head you can trust, I’ll be glad to build you one , it wont be cheep but it will be right,the first time, as Jim would say, BAM,

heres a tip for all you DYI guys, check the valve clearance AFTER you torque the head, It will change and that way you eliminate leaving ecentrics loose.also something us pros do on every valve adj is to make sure the oil tubes are tight allthough this is more for m30s and m10s.

#169

bdigel wrote:

[quote]Ranger, if you want a cyl head you can trust, I’ll be glad to build you one , it wont be cheep but it will be right,the first time, as Jim would say, BAM,

[/quote]

Roger that. A guy in another forum, the other day, asked about engine rebuilders in the Atl area. I told him to run, not walk to Brenden Digel and Chuck Baader. Make a decision between you two, and pay whatever you wanted with a great big smile on their face.

Easy advice to give.

#170

Y’know, I’m starting to think that it was my local shop that did this. The shop that helped me build the bottom end. When I took the car to them to figure out the clanking noise (head wasn’t on straight because lack of dowel pin) we took the head (with manifolds) off and set it down on their floor. When I returned the next day, the head had been moved and inverted. I wonder if that clip, or whatever you call it, can’t just fall right out if you invert the head.

As I look at a different head, it’s not so obvious when the clip is in place, but pretty glaringly missing when it is gone. I was in god’s own hurry when I put the head on at the shop that next day. I essentially grabbed someone to help me pick up the head and manifolds, set it down on my motor and drove on. The midday sun was blazing on me and I was working under a helova tight schedule.

#171

Scott, whoever set the head on its top (rocker arm side) probably did the damage. The head cannot be set on its top with the oiling tube attached. Generally, the retaining clip will not fall out…look at the deformed metal on the clip…it shows where it was driven in with a hammer.

The clip that holds the rocker shafts keeps them from rotating along with locating them fore and aft. If the shafts rotate, the oil holes are not where they are supposed to be, lubrication is lost, so yes, your rockers are toast. In addition anytime a timing belt is broken, most, if not all, the rockers should be replaced. Be sure and blueprint the new rockers before assembly.

When I build a head, I always adjust the valves to .010". After assembly, the motor should be run approximately 30 minutes at 1500-2000rpm to break in the rockers and to somewhat seat the valves. Readjust the valves, cold, to .008". After the first track weekend, readjust again to .008" with the motor cold and it should be good for the season. Chuck

#172

why 0.008" instead of 0.010"?

#173

BMW changed the specification a few years ago. Note, due to the configuration of the head, the gap actually increases as temp climbs.

Also, less gap=more cam…Chuck

#174

cwbaader wrote:

Speaking of which, has anyone run a “typical” 150-200k cam on a Cam Doctor to see what duration and lift we are really getting?

Steve D.

#175

Cams can be blue printed by Delta Camshaft. They have all the profiles for stock cams beginning I don’t know when. They had the stock profile for my '84 “e” cam which they did when I built my car three years ago. Been in every motor since. This should be part of a comprehensive motor build. Chuck

#176

Apparently when the rocker arm shafts started turning, due to an absence of the locking bar, it cut off most of the oiling to the cam. The cam lobes, journals, and journal holes in the head got beat up. The $1900 + core head is a total loss.

Oh my god. Whew. That’s a little unexpected.

Right now I’m a little unhappy with the local shop that apparently bonked my head around such that the locking bar fell out.

#177

Ranger wrote:

[quote]Apparently when the rocker arm shafts started turning, due to an absence of the locking bar, it cut off most of the oiling to the cam. The cam lobes, journals, and journal holes in the head got beat up. The $1900 + core head is a total loss.

Oh my god. Whew. That’s a little unexpected.

Right now I’m a little unhappy with the local shop that apparently bonked my head around such that the locking bar fell out.[/quote]

Are you being sarcastic or is $1900 a truly a good news to you?

I’m sorry but just can’t tell anymore with the rate at which you are spending to fix the car.

#178

csrow wrote:

[quote]Ranger wrote:

[quote]Apparently when the rocker arm shafts started turning, due to an absence of the locking bar, it cut off most of the oiling to the cam. The cam lobes, journals, and journal holes in the head got beat up. The $1900 + core head is a total loss.

Oh my god. Whew. That’s a little unexpected.

Right now I’m a little unhappy with the local shop that apparently bonked my head around such that the locking bar fell out.[/quote]

Are you being sarcastic or is $1900 a truly a good news to you?

I’m sorry but just can’t tell anymore with the rate at which you are spending to fix the car.[/quote]

I was figuring on a couple hundred to replace a couple valves and rockers. I’d made the call in Feb to get out from under the Molitor head problems for sure and forever by buying an absolutely, no doubt about it, best-in-class head. I’ve been fighting the good fight with these engine issues, but it’s a hard blow for my pricey head to be destroyed.

I think I’ll just wallow in self-pity and beer for the evening.

Later edit. When I put the head on a couple days prior to RA the engine “clanked” so I took the car to the race shop that helped me build the bottom end. They charged me for 6hrs labor as they measured everything they could short of taking the head off, in order to find a possible cause of the clanking. I can’t help but wonder if, in those 6hrs of screwing around with my rockers and cam, if they didn’t remove the locking bar.

#179

Really sorry to hear about all this Scott. Very difficult stretch for you, good luck with your next steps.

#180

I’ve been thinking about how my head could have been missing the rocker arm shaft retaining bar. And the answer has to be that the local shop did it. They charged me for 6hrs labor to figure out the source of the clanking sound. They spent 6hrs (which seems like a lot) staring at my rockers and cam fiddling and measuring. You can’t tell me that a “professional” engine builder can take a rocker arm cover off and stare at an M20 head for 6hrs and not notice that the absence of the retaining bar.

Therefore the retaining bar had to be there.

I showed up a couple hrs later, and removed the head. That’s when we spotted the cause of the clanking.

The next morning I showed up with the dowel for the block and put the head back on.

I went by the shop this morning to ask if they had any retaining bars laying around. I didn’t go into any details. The mechanic wasn’t in. I’ll go back later today. This had to be the chain of events.

Oh, Metric Mechanic is working over the weekend to replace my head at their cost. I talked to them a couple days ago about what occured. They were convinced that they’d shipped the head to me (the 2nd time) with the retaining pin installed. Later that night I sent them an email that essentially agreed with them. They had apparently been getting down a bit over the last couple of months about human nature because they had to take it in the shorts from a couple customers that might not have been entirely straight up with them.

My nice email to them apparently had a big affect, restoring some of their battered faith in human nature, and they decided to build me a new head from scratch over the weekend for only the cost of the parts. That’s major shit. Nice guys do sometimes finish first.