Fuel Tank: replace it, clean it, or let it ride?


#1

I’m building my '87 for SpecE30, and am doing HPDEs now. I am in the midst of going over the fuel system. High pressure pump has been replaced, transfer pump will be replaced. After finally getting a look in the tank, it’s pretty nasty. There is a good amount of sediment; it isn’t really loose, but it scrapes off easily. The car sat for a long time before I bought it. So, what should I do? RockAuto has the tank for $190 shipped. I’ve never cleaned a tank before, but I’ve heard it’s nothing too complicated, just messy. I’ve already installed an inline filter before the high pressure pump in addition to the stock one between the pump and the rail, so I could just plan on replacing these frequently.

So, in your experience, will some nastiness on the walls of the tank cause problems later on? Does cleaning just send more crud into the pumps? Or is a fresh new tank worth the peace of mind?


#2

Rust kills pumps. Pumps are expensive. Talk to Jim Levie about the cleaning and sealing solution. I’d be tempted to just replace it. Be careful to get the correct tank. Or at least, if you do get a non-'87 tank, it’s because you plan to go to a single pump, as opposed to an “oops”.


#3

A layer of rust in the bottom of the tank is bad juju. When you start throwing the car around the track sloshing fuel will stir up the rust. It will then collect on the inlet screen of the pump and starve the engine for fuel. Suction will keep the rust on the screen until you shut off the engine.

More than half of the work involved in cleaning and sealing a tank is removing and re-installing the tank. Which you have to do whether you are cleaning the tank or replacing it. Cleaning and sealing the tank can be done over a weekend pretty easily. Especially if you drop the tank Friday evening. If your tank is otherwise in good condition cleaning and sealing the tank is a lot cheaper than a new tank. My experience with a rusty tank are:

A twenty year old car with a steel gas tank can have a surprising amount of
rust in the tank. That rust can and will clog the pump inlet screens and
filter and cause the high pressure pump to have a short life. While a
new tank will certainly fix that, you can clean and seal the tank for a lot
less money.

My 87 325is suffered from this. The car ran fine on the street but the first
time I took it to the track for a test & tune it was as if the car had a soft
rev limiter that decreased by 500-700rpm per lap. Some particulate matter did
come out of the tank when I drained the gas, but with the in-tank pump out I
could see a layer of crud in the bottom of the tank that was about an 1/8"
deep. On the track that stuff got stirred up, clogged the inlet screens &
filter, and starved the engine. It also ate up the internals of the high
pressure pump. Rust is a fairly abrasive material.

The first attempt at a fix was to have the tank acid dipped and install new
pumps & filter. Either they didn’t leave the tank in long enough or the acid
was a bit depleted, but the result was less than satifactory as the next time
I had the car on the track the high pressure pump started buzzing and I ran
into the same starvation issue.

After taking the tank out again and sloshing about a gallon of fuel around I
got loads of rust out of the tank. The new filter was heavily loaded and the
inlet screen of the high pressure pump was also loaded up. And the cross-over
pipe was completely plugged. This time I was determined to get all of the rust
out and follow that up with sealant to lock down anything that was left and
prevent further rusting. I used a gas tank sealer kit from Eastwood, but went
a bit further than they suggest.

The tank, having been recently acid dipped had no varnish in it. So a simple
wash with a strong TSP solution removed the remaining organics. I made up a
simple plug for the hole where the in-tank pump mounts that could easily be
removed. Think of a round disk of plywood with a bar on the bottom and a couple
of screws to snug the bar up. Drop that into the opening, rotate slighty to
engage the lock ears on the tank and tighten the screws. The remaining
openings were closed up with pieces of a freezer bag held in place with rubber
bands.

About a gallon of diluted acid in the tank was about right. That was enough to
slosh around well but not so much as too make the tank to heavy. I used an acid
mix sold for cleaning masonry that’s composed of Hydrochloric and Phosphoric
acids at about double the normal dilution. Over the course of a couple of
hours I’d slosh and flip tank every fifteen minutes to wet all parts of the
tank with the solution. At the end of a couple of hours I drained the tank and
disposed of the pretty well spent acid by reacting it with limestone gravel.

To flush the tank I made up a right-angle spray nozzle with plumbing fittings
and a 1/4" hose barb. That allowed the nozzle to be inserted into the tank and
a high velocity stream sprayed into all corners. This was done with the tank
at about a 30deg angle (drain plug hole down) and the fluid collected into a
bucket. When the water ran clean and no more loose junk came out I repeated
the acid treatment and flush. It took all of one Saturday and part of Sunday
to get the tank to the point that no more rust could be seen and nothing was
being flushed out of the tank.

The last steps were to use the acid etch from the Eastwood kit, flush with
acetone, and apply the sealer. Before putting the sealer in the tank I removed
the cross-over pipe and sealed those openings. And after the sealer had been
applied and before it had a chance to harden I blew out those openings and the
tubing that runs across the top of the tank with compressed air. After drying
for a couple of days the tank was reassembled and reinstalled in the car.

Once sealed the inside of the tank had a fairly uniform white coating. I did
see a few specks of matter that I wasn’t able to flush from the tank, but
those were well locked in place by the sealer.

Cleaning and sealing the tank is pretty labor intensive. But at a total cost
of less than $80 it is a lot cheaper than a new tank (~$400 for this car).


#4

I installed a $175 radiator from ebay - theradiatorconnection. It all fit well. However, in trouble shooting my injectors, I noticed the gas being delivered to be a little redder than what you get from the pump. I believe it to be from an antirust coating on the inside of the tank.

I also feel the car’s a little off on power, but that may just be me. I’m about half a tank down from a full tank which should have rinsed the coating off pretty well by now. I go to CMP this weekend. After I finish that tank I’ll swap the fuel filter and then refill and see if it makes a difference.

Additional reading can be found at

http://spece30.com/component/option,com_kunena/Itemid,94/func,view/id,42018/catid,5/

KB


#5

Merry Christmas - http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/BMW-325I-1987-GAS-FUEL-TANK-NIB-BRAND-NEW-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem3a57842477QQitemZ250576381047QQptZMotorsQ5fCarQ5fTruckQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories


#6

In my opinion, this is just a no brainer, given that I just had the same issues you are having. Get a brand new replacement tank and be done. I think mine was $200 delivered to the door. I put in a new transfer pump and a new main pump.

Make sure you put in a new crossover tube, too. I got mine at Pelican. I guess you can clean yours real well and seal it, but I’ll leave that up to you. The Pelican crossover tube was almost $50.

-Scott


#7

Thanks for the input everyone. I ordered the new tank and in-tank pump from RockAuto last night. Jim, that’s an excellent writeup of how to clean the fuel tank properly. The main thing I took away is that it’s fair amount of work, and requires dealing with a lot of nasty stuff. My landlady definitely wouldn’t be too happy with that much acid and gasoline winding up on her lawn.

Roadster, due to your experience, I’ll definitely be throwing in a gallon of gas, sloshing it around and draining it to remove any coating on the inside of the tank.

Scott, I haven’t looked at the crossover tube at all yet, but thanks for the heads up. I’ll have to take a look at mine once I start the teardown.

–Alex


#8

BigKeyserSoze wrote:

After seeing the price of the cross over tube, I opted for a gallon of carburetor soak cleaner w/basket at about half the price(~$20). Cleaned it up well and I can use it in the next couple of years for other serious parts cleaning.

I had no problems with the fittings resealing.


#9

Ha! Pulled the plugs to check/set the valves this a.m. The spark plugs seem to have some kind of black coating on them - it’s not soot or oil. I’ve never seen anything like this. It’s got to be the fuel contaminated by the new tank coating. Guess I’ll really have to change the filter plus plugs after finishing this tank of fuel. (It’s going to be hot as stink @ CMP this weekend and I’m tired of working on the car).

I have an associate at work that circle tracks. He suggested to keep adding fuel as frequently as possible to water the bad gas down. I don’t buy into that because I think it will make the purging process take longer.


#10

[quote=“BigKeyserSoze” post=48308]In my opinion, this is just a no brainer, given that I just had the same issues you are having. Get a brand new replacement tank and be done. I think mine was $200 delivered to the door. I put in a new transfer pump and a new main pump.

Make sure you put in a new crossover tube, too. I got mine at Pelican. I guess you can clean yours real well and seal it, but I’ll leave that up to you. The Pelican crossover tube was almost $50.

-Scott[/quote]

Scott

Where did you get your tank from?? Pelican? I need one ASAP

Thanks

Shoe


#11

I can’t answer for Scott, but I got mine from The Radiator Connection on eBay for a great price: http://stores.ebay.com/THE-RADIATOR-CONNECTION

I installed it over the winter along with new in tank and external pump and I can report that my fuel starvation issues appear to be gone as I have run the tank down below half full without fuel starving this year.


#12

I got mine from Rock Auto…less than $220 shipped. That along with 2 new pumps (Airtex, also from RockAuto) solved my problems.


#13

For the first time I actually looked in my fuel tank.

Background. My car (Old #6) has always been a hiccuper. Instead of fixing it I adjusted weight such that I could start a race with a fuel tank. At Roebling I could go to a half tank, at Road Atl I could get to 5gal’s before the hiccuping started. Both pumps were replaced years ago, and the filter and FPR has been replaced several times. The symptoms never changed. I assumed therefore that the cause was rust in the tank.

Turns out that my tanks was squeeky clean, as was the pipe connecting the two sides. I’ll never know what the cause of the problem was. If I had to guess, I’d say that it was related to tank ventilation since that’s about the only thing left.


#14

I bought a new tank at Autozone for about $200…


#15

Just bought a new tank from Rockauto, 217 bucks. Im doing an 87 to a 90 conversion any crazy issues that i should be aware of? I bought a new pump for a 90 as well. What else will I need?