In that case you’d be violating the rule I proposed as a full undertray provides aero benefit and thus serves another purpose other than just protecting the sump. [/quote]
Rules that require judgement suck. The current plate provides an aero benefit too, albeit a smaller advantage than my hypothetical plate. I’d be game for a maximum length and width. Without a maximum thickness, I should be able to get rid of my ballast in the passenger floor. Lowwww CG. :laugh:
Brake proportioning is unnecessary. You can use different pad compounds easily enough. I’d rather not have jokers on the grid near me who are playing with brake bias. No offense guys, but we’re not that good that we need it or can get much net benefit out of it. :woohoo:
In that case you’d be violating the rule I proposed as a full undertray provides aero benefit and thus serves another purpose other than just protecting the sump. [/quote]
Rules that require judgement suck. The current plate provides an aero benefit too, albeit a smaller advantage than my hypothetical plate. I’d be game for a maximum length and width. Without a maximum thickness, I should be able to get rid of my ballast in the passenger floor. Lowwww CG. :laugh:[/quote]
Good point. How about:
A skid plate is permitted provided that it attaches only to and does not extend beyond the radiator core support and front cross member and is not more than 24" wide.
As to weight, if placement of ballast is free the mass of a skid plate becomes a non-issue. Though why you’d want more weight on the front of the car is beyond me. One second thought, I encourage you to make weight by placing all of the ballast forward of the front cross member. The will make for “entertaining & exciting” handling.
How about:
A non-adjustable brake bias valve can be substituted for the OE valve.
+1 on being able to lower the steering column. As I’ve been placing my seat during the build, the stock wheel position feels like an apehanger motorcycle handlebar.
The weight topic seems to be touchy. After re-reading some of the arguments for or against a weight change, I would tend to believe that if the minimum weight gets lowered, then ballast placement should be free.
Not that I’m racing yet, but would definitely like to see:
Weight reduction
Open exhaust manufacturers. Tried emailing paul poore, no response. I can easily fab up a cheapo exhaust in my garage for $50, rather than $300.
Engine claim rule ($1,000-1,500) Everyone can pick up motors for about$250-350. Keep your receipts. If all the engine specs check out, engine can be resold to another racer, for the claim price. Those that have killer expensive motors can be resold to others.
Ability to adjust the steering wheel (saftey). You have to be comfortable driving a race car.
Not a huge fan of the brake bias stuff. As others have mentioned, it adds another adjustability factor that I’m not sure is really needed. I would always adjust my bias with pads.
Don’t agree at all with the dyno testing. Too much variability. I work with dynos every day as a job. There are plenty of ways to fool the dyno anyway.
One of the things I loved about showroom stock was keeping things simple. Mucho track time, and hanging out with beers is why I go.
[quote]Not that I’m racing yet, but would definitely like to see:
Engine claim rule ($1,000-1,500) Everyone can pick up motors for about$250-350. Keep your receipts. If all the engine specs check out, engine can be resold to another racer, for the claim price. Those that have killer expensive motors can be resold to others.
[/quote]
Hmmm. I have 20 months of frustration and $$ invested that finally culminated in engine #9. You could kidnap one of my children and my reaction would not be as severe as you taking engine #9.
Buy an M20B25 straight from BMW for $5k. Have a local shop do the engine swap for you for another $1500. Then some guy takes your engine, leaves you with a rolling chassis and a check for $1500, and says “we’re good, right? There’s a junkyard one county over”.
There was a guy here last year that went thru 5 engines in a year and got so bummed out that he left the NASA DE ladder. He was a youngster and didn’t have the credit cards that us middle aged guys have. It was his last engine that he got direct from BMW, and I think that one was working ok while he was attempting to sell his car.
He went thru enough that it, well, broke him. Emotionally, and to some extent financially. After all of that, a person would take his OEM motor from him and call it even with the $1500 check? Not.
Unlike me, that kid was probably emotionally stable, and not given to violent outbursts of rage.
[quote]Buy an M20B25 straight from BMW for $5k. Have a local shop do the engine swap for you for another $1500. Then some guy takes your engine, leaves you with a rolling chassis and a check for $1500, and says “we’re good, right? There’s a junkyard one county over”.
There was a guy here last year that went thru 5 engines in a year and got so bummed out that he left the NASA DE ladder. He was a youngster and didn’t have the credit cards that us middle aged guys have. It was his last engine that he got direct from BMW, and I think that one was working ok while he was attempting to sell his car.
He went thru enough that it, well, broke him. Emotionally, and to some extent financially. After all of that, a person would take his OEM motor from him and call it even with the $1500 check? Not.
Unlike me, that kid was probably emotionally stable, and not given to violent outbursts of rage.[/quote]
not to mention he didn’t attempt to shoot his neighbors either
Does anyone actually drive their car to the track? I might be the poorest of anyone attempting to race in spec e30 and I can’t afford to not make it to work on monday because my racecar blew up and it was also my way home. I think we should give up on keeping the rules street legal friendly and allow the removal of headlights, turn signals, marker lights and horns. Does anyone actually race with the 2 factory horns which you are curently required to have? Anyone driving there car to the track is going to be uncompetive anyway because the fact that the spec exhaust is not street legal.
I still like to drive mine on the street after making changes, hence the license plate. I haven’t removed the factory horns. Both my headlights work and my turn signals. I think the idea is to keep them looking like BMW E30s hence the dash rule. I’m not afraid of being pulled over for the Spec Exhaust. I like the way our cars look on track with the headlights.
I drive mine on the street on occasion. I’ve found it’s very handy to check things out between races, and it’s nice to not have to tow the car everywhere, like for an alignment or something.
I would not encourage anyone to race W2W and need the car to go to work…that’s just asking for disaster.
My motor is nothing special. Same one that came in the 170k donor, but with a freshened head.
You want to claim it? Fine. Give me cash for what it would cost me to find another one with equal compression/leakdown numbers and crank scraper. And pay me what it will cost to pull it and put the new one in - at a professional shop, not the dismantler down the street. Do I get to keep my fresh injectors?
As soon as you pass a claimer rule, I am emailing one of my buddies with a deal. Each race, we claim each other’s motor. Maybe we get 4 of us and do a round robin. We claim them, then leave them in the cars.
Right now, the culture is friendly. If you want to turn this into Saturday night dirt track BS, start a claimer rule.
We have a set of rules that can/need to be enforced. Like a claimer rule, it would require spending some money on enforcement. So far, peer pressure has been cheaper and more effective.
PS - This class is very welcoming to new folks. That is a great thing and I try to do my part. [rant] Personally though, I get annoyed when new folks show up and want significant rule changes before they turn a wheel. [/rant]
[quote]
PS - This class is very welcoming to new folks. That is a great thing and I try to do my part. [rant] Personally though, I get annoyed when new folks show up and want significant rule changes before they turn a wheel. [/rant][/quote]
+1
My motor is nothing special. Same one that came in the 170k donor, but with a freshened head.
You want to claim it? Fine. Give me cash for what it would cost me to find another one with equal compression/leakdown numbers and crank scraper. And pay me what it will cost to pull it and put the new one in - at a professional shop, not the dismantler down the street. Do I get to keep my fresh injectors?
As soon as you pass a claimer rule, I am emailing one of my buddies with a deal. Each race, we claim each other’s motor. Maybe we get 4 of us and do a round robin. We claim them, then leave them in the cars.
Right now, the culture is friendly. If you want to turn this into Saturday night dirt track BS, start a claimer rule.
We have a set of rules that can/need to be enforced. Like a claimer rule, it would require spending some money on enforcement. So far, peer pressure has been cheaper and more effective.
PS - This class is very welcoming to new folks. That is a great thing and I try to do my part. [rant] Personally though, I get annoyed when new folks show up and want significant rule changes before they turn a wheel. [/rant][/quote]
I’m with Steve on this one. I haven’t touched my motor since I bought the car 4 years ago and the guy who had it before me didn’t do anything other than basic maintenance. It’s an unmolested stock motor. It’s no where near to the fastest motor out there. But it’s solid and does pretty well for what it is. In other words I haven’t spent a dime on my motor and I don’t plan to until it blows up. I would not be happy if someone claimed it for $1000 or even $2000.
I’d like to nominate this idea as the worst idea ever. But that’s just my opinion
Changing the engine in a dirt track semi-tube frame car with AN lines, etc. is different than in our ‘stockish’ cars.
Most of the guys that compete in claimer classes build their engines with that in mind. They’re built to run a few hours - qualy + race and then they’re toast. Google dirt track / claimer for more info or subscribe to “Circle Track”.
The best way to administer performance is restrictor plates / NASCAR style. Or as Grand-Am has done with spec ECU’s and copious data logging, “someone” then reviews and uses weight / whatever else to adjust. Both of these are changes and $$$$.
In lieu of that peer pressure is pretty darn good, except when you’re a good driver like Steve D. then you have to hear about your motor all the time, but that is a small price to pay.
[quote]…except when you’re a good driver like Steve D. then you have to hear about your motor all the time, but that is a small price to pay.[/quote]Since compliments are tough to come by, I am going to pretend that was NOT tongue-in-cheek and say “thanks”. :laugh:
Lowwww CG. :laugh:
if someone claimed it for $1000 or even $2000.